ListMailPRO Email Marketing Software Forums
ListMailPRO Email Marketing Software Forums => General Help & How-To => Topic started by: macaspeer on February 12, 2009, 06:15:29 pm
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Howdy y'all!
I am sensing bad bad things around the forum. It has a very eerie feel. No talk from the leadership.
And, in fact, it's causing me to have some serious doubts about my ability to keep running my websites.
Not to belabor the point, but I am not able to resolve certain issues, and I don't get the feeling that I'm going to get much help from admin.
Mostly just wondering ... how are you guys feeling about your sites?
I've been running in 4 niches for the last 4 years, and just recently my server limited my email send to 250 per hour. And I can't figure out how to throttle my messages.
Basically, at this point, without having the ability to adjust this setting, I have no reason to send emails. Most of my lists are too big to limit them that much.
Anyhow ... I'm feeling a little saddened, and wondering if it's really worth it? To be honest, I never thought I'd say that ... because I love doing this so much. But this is dragging me down.
How you guys doing?
Hopefully you're doing better than me! Give a shout out if you're doing well ... hopefully it'll pick me up a bit.
Best Wishes!
Al
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Hi Al,
I understand your frustation - but at least your sites are running.
I can't even access my LMP server (hosted by Dean) and it has been down for a month!
I can only assume something has happened with Dean - usually he is very responsive to email.
I am not on your side of the Atlantic, is it possible to make some enquiries about Dean's well-being?
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Yeah- we're frozen... can't access anything.
All of our databases we've built up over the years are inaccessible and basically our business can't move forward.
We are definitely scared. Not sure what to do. :shock:
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I think first we need to find out what has happened to Dean. Is he ill - has something happened to him? Does anyone have a phone number for him?
Second: it would be helpful if we could find out where he hosts our LPM servers. I can still ping my URL but I cannot access the admin page which would suggest the server is still alive and maybe the db is down.
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We have paid for listmail and a full installation but I hadn't been able to get on the site for weeks - it just wasn't loading at all - until today.
Also have tried to email Dena but just get bouncebacks and undeliverable messages.
Am now wondering if it's a good idea to submit all informaiton relating to hosting information and apsswords etc until someone hears from Dean or anyone else from listmail itself.
Has anyone else had any joy?
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Helen,
I found this number searching for Dean's name on the net, 604-466-0871
I have just tried calling it from the UK (13:30 local time) and it went to voice mail. I will try this number again this evening. In the meantime if someone on the other side of the Atlantic (Canada or US) would like to try this number that would be good.
Paul.
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I'm UK based too so can't be any more help - can anyone else help?!
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Domain name: listmailpro.com
Registrant Contact:
WhoisGuard
WhoisGuard Protected ()
Fax:
8939 S. Sepulveda Blvd. #110 - 732
Westchester, CA 90045
US
Administrative Contact:
WhoisGuard
WhoisGuard Protected (ede2aff3d42c457c84e2f88a32ce0042.protect@whoisguard.com)
+1.6613102107
Fax: +1.6613102107
8939 S. Sepulveda Blvd. #110 - 732
Westchester, CA 90045
US
Technical Contact:
WhoisGuard
WhoisGuard Protected (ede2aff3d42c457c84e2f88a32ce0042.protect@whoisguard.com)
+1.6613102107
Fax: +1.6613102107
8939 S. Sepulveda Blvd. #110 - 732
Westchester, CA 90045
US
Status: Locked
Name Servers:
NS1.LMHOST.COM
NS2.LMHOST.COM
Creation date: 07 Jun 2002 13:19:57
Expiration date: 07 Jun 2009 13:19:57
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Hi,
I am having no luck trying to contact Dean - the number I have just goes to voice mail. My mail server is still down and I cannot access the control panel. My annoyance at the server being down is tempered by my anxiety that something serious has happened to Dean.
Short of getting on a plane and going to his house I am not sure what else I can do.
Does anyone on the forum have any suggestions?
Also please can those of you affected contact me by email paul@earthstory.co.uk (I will remove this email address in a few days) just in case this site goes down too.
Thanks,
Paul.
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Not sure why you guys are down but my site is also hosted by Dean and still up so his server can't be down. I have his pager number so will send a message and see if he responds.
Steve
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Not sure why you guys are down but my site is also hosted by Dean and still up so his server can't be down. I have his pager number so will send a message and see if he responds.
Steve
Hi Steve,
I can still ping my server so I am thinking it could be the db problem I have had many times before. Whatever the problem this has been down for more than a month.
Please can you let us know the outcome of paging Dean.
Thanks,
Paul.
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Any joy? I am still waiting to hear so I can even get listmail installed but am feeling a bit like that might never actually happen now.
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Hi Helen,
Please can you email me paul@earthstory.co.uk
Thanks,
Paul.
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Hi, I paged Dean 24 hours ago but so far no response.
Has anyone tried paying the fee for him to do work to get their software up and running again? . It does say above 'due to overwhelming paid work.....' This might show one way to find out if he is around or not. You book the jobs with a form an cc from what I remember.
Perhaps this is his way of getting away for a holiday or something.
Steve
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Hi, I paged Dean 24 hours ago but so far no response.
Has anyone tried paying the fee for him to do work to get their software up and running again? . It does say above 'due to overwhelming paid work.....' This might show one way to find out if he is around or not. You book the jobs with a form an cc from what I remember.
Perhaps this is his way of getting away for a holiday or something.
Hi Steve,
Not sure how this applies.
Dean hosts my LMP server for which I pay each month. My server has been down for over a month now. Other people have paid for LMP installation and the work has not yet been done. I don't see how this can be Dean taking a holiday.
Paul.
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The notice in red on the site make me think he is away on purpose and I thought perhaps a holiday was the answer. If it was an accident or somthing was unplanned I doubt that message would be there.
I want to move my hosting to a site I have better contact with but I guess I need Deans action to help me do that and can't contact him. Is there any other way anyone knows of I can move the mail program without his input?
Steve
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The notice in red on the site make me think he is away on purpose and I thought perhaps a holiday was the answer. If it was an accident or somthing was unplanned I doubt that message would be there.
I want to move my hosting to a site I have better contact with but I guess I need Deans action to help me do that and can't contact him. Is there any other way anyone knows of I can move the mail program without his input?
Steve
Hi Steve,
I would strongly recommend (if you haven't already) you take advantage of LMP excellent db back up facility. In theory if you export what you have now you could continue with another host by installing LMP and changing the name servers.
About the red notice . . . I think it has been there for a while - can anyone else confirm?
Either way I don't believe Dean would just walk away from his responsibilities maintaining the LMP servers, but if this is not resolved by the end of March I will be stopping any further payments.
Thanks,
Paul.
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Unfortunately, I have no choice but to give up. All of a sudden my login script stopped working. I'm not sure why that is. It's been over a month since I sent e-mail and submitted a support ticket. I have to switch mailing list programs so I can contact my list. I'm just the database is on my server so I can log into that to get the user information.
I don't know what happened to Dean and I hope he's alright, but this situation has made me think twice about using proprietary software from a individual programmer or a small company. While I would like to support them, I also can't take the risk of getting stuck like this. This is really kind of scary for me.
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I don't know what happened to Dean and I hope he's alright, but this situation has made me think twice about using proprietary software from a individual programmer or a small company. While I would like to support them, I also can't take the risk of getting stuck like this. This is really kind of scary for me.
Hi Antonia,
I agree. It is also a bit frustrating that even with all the technology we have we still can't discover what has happened to Dean! My credit card is still being debited with charge for the hosting, I can still ping my list server so something is still working. Do you have a backup of your database?
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I have also now given up. We paid our money and submitted our details to install listmail but never ever heard anything back despite repeated attempts at chasing Dean. So Ig uess we've lost our money and I've now gone elsewhere to get what we need - otherwise we'd be waiting for who knows how long before any kind of support is offered. Really disappointed with it all, especially considering how helpful Dean had been in the past.
Seems a bit convenient that people's money still keeps on being taken moenth by month with nothing in return and not a peep from the powers that be. I definitely smell a rat - perhaps another victim of the credit crunch? I'd like to think that wasn't the case but I have no faith any more.
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Seems a bit convenient that people's money still keeps on being taken moenth by month with nothing in return and not a peep from the powers that be. I definitely smell a rat - perhaps another victim of the credit crunch? I'd like to think that wasn't the case but I have no faith any more.
Hi Helen,
I understand you must be seriously p**sed off if you have paid for something you have not received - not sure about the rat smell though. It makes no sense that Dean has done a runner - I would be seriously dissappointed and surprised if he had. If you have paid for something with a credit card is it possible either you can get a refund or they can do some investigation as to why you have not received the goods?
Paul.
P.S. please make a note of my email address paul@earthstory.co.uk - let's stay in contact in case this site goes down too.
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I found this when doing a search for Dean Wiebe:
http://www.facebook.com/people/Dean-Wiebe/1048933956
if this is Dean is it possible to contact some of his friends to find out if he is okay?
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Do you have a backup of your database?
I didn't have the good sense to keep a regular backup but, fortunately, I am able to login directly to my database (phpMyAdmin) and export my user and list information from there.
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Do you have a backup of your database?
I didn't have the good sense to keep a regular backup but, fortunately, I am able to login directly to my database (phpMyAdmin) and export my user and list information from there.
How are you using phpMyAdmin to access your db?
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Hi All,
I've used LMP for years (since 2004), it works fine, and still does, but I'm running my own server. I'm not sure what's up with Dean, but I can guess that is his Facebook profile, he does live in Vancouver. I always thought he was a little lost when it came to updating things - but never like this.
Sorry to hear you're all without host/services, what a total drag - I would recommend trying a service such as GetResponse, or Aweber, at least you know you'll get someone on the phone there. I've been considering that move myself recently...
As for the red message, I noticed this website was down completely, sometime in Feb, not sure when, when it came back online (after at least 2-3 days that I know of), I saw the red message. I have to assume that paid support are the only one's that are going to get it...
Best of luck with it all - I'll be moving my data to another service, or software...
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Hi!
I know how to export my lists so I have a backup of subscribers, but I have no idea how to do a complete backup and the online help instructions are not particularly helpful. Can anyone tell me how to do that?
Nevermind I figured out how to backup and now have the file on my own computer, but what to do next depends on where this is going to be hosted. So...the next question is still relevent. Thots?
Next question is where does one find a server to host LMP. The problem with my website host is the limits they place on outgoing email. My list is too big to have a limit of 250/day. It also needs to be reputable so we don't get emails bouncing because of other people's behavior.
Does anyone have any thoughts on how best to proceed?
BTW I have requested to be Dean's friend on Facebook. Let you know if I get a response. I didn't recognize any of his friends so I haven't tried to contact any of them.
I'm with the folks that think something's happened to him. This is so totally out of character.
-Susan
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Like many of you I am seeking Dean's whereabouts. I have made several attempts to his "friends" list on his facebook page (vancouver, bc), but have not heard back from them either. I am fearing the worst, that something serious has happened to Dean, as he has NEVER been without communication for this length of time. I backed up everything from my listmail program and I am beginning to look for another webhost. Dreading this move, as I have several sites, databases, folders and files to move...and to hope it all comes back working the same way it did. Guessing many headaches are ahead. Wanted to ask Dean about a "backup" plan should something happen to him (but never got around to it), meaning I wanted to ask him if he had someone who was able to blast an email message to his customers should he be taken ill, injured, etc. Wishing now I would have gotten around to it, or better yet, had some other contact information from his hosting company. Does anybody know who he is renting his servers from? Maybe we could start there?
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As near as I can tell, something serious must have happened to Dean to be this out of touch. We have tried email, this forum, Facebook, phone and text messages (a colleague had that) and still no response.
Guess there's a lesson here for all of us. I know I don't have an adequate backup plan should something happen to me.
LMP is still working for me on Dean's server though bounce rates are up, but a new server is definitely needed.
Does anyone have any suggestions?
And is anyone here techie enough to do the installation? Or know someone who can?
I'm sure I could figure it out but I don't want to take the time. Would much rather pay someone to do it.
Thots?
Susan
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I'm in the same boat as you Susan. Not really comfortable with doing the installation myself. Was just hoping that by uploading the mail folder and files to my new server, creating the same database, restore the LMP database and then pray it works.
I have decided to move to VPS hosting with knownhost.com. Paying about 35 a month. Have only had shared hosting to this point, so not sure what headaches VPS will bring. I have 256mb of RAM, which I have no idea if that is good or when it will cause problems and need upgrading. I think that is the problem I will face. I have plenty of disk space and bandwidth, but the RAM is an area I am not comfortable with (nor am I comfortable with VPS hosting). Not ready to make the financial commitment to dedicated hosting, but at least for now the VPS hosting will allow unlimited emails (which of course will probably raise my RAM usage and then the headaches begin!) I will monitor very closely as I move everything over.
As for Dean, I have heard nothing. I have even sent messages to his friends on facebook and they have not even had the courtesy to reply. Very strange. It's like he vanished from the face of the earth. By the looks of the picture on his facebook, he is a young guy, so really concerned about this vanishing act. Not in character for him at all.
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Jangell, please keep us posted re: VPS and knownhost.com.
I have an email inquiry into Dreamhost. Reports been mixed here in the forum.
Right now I'm still working off Dean's server. The worst that's happened so far is I'm not getting through to Comcast or sbcglobal addresses and bounce rates are moving up toward 10%.
It is strange about Dean, and I agree totally out of character. I found a way to text him and didn't get anything. Included my email so if he's unable somebody else could get back to me, but no one did. Strange about his friends not responding. Something's definitely up.
Oh well, we just all need to find new hosting before this system disappears. Keep us all posted.
Susan
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So far so good. It will certainly cost me much more than Dean, but so far they seem pretty good. Support is excellent and very quick to respond. At first they said they could not migrate my old host sites to the new VPS host without 'sudo' access, whatever that means, so thought I was in trouble. They have since found a way to transfer the files and databases from one plesk account to the other. Of course the real test will be when they migrate my LMP. Can't wait! Got a note from one of the Facebook Friends of Dean Wiebe from Vancouver, BC. Evidently that is NOT his facebook page, as they said I had the wrong person. So, more than one DW in Vancouver. I will post back if I get successful migration of my LMP. Should happen in the next day or so.
:cry:
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Great!
How much are you paying?
And I'm particularly interested in their bounce rates...ie do they actively address wrongful blacklisting issues. Dean's been really good about that...under 1% until recently and now pushing 10%. Most of that is Comcast and sbcglobal.
Before I switched to LMP I was using 1shoppingcart and bounce rates were consistently 15-20%. Horrible.
Thanks for the update
Susan[/i]
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Hi!
Paul suggested we start a new thread on hosting options but since we've already started here, I'm inclined to keep it all in one place.
Here is the response I got from Dreamhost to my query.
Hello,
Thanks for writing in! I will be happy to answer your questions. Yes, you
should be able to use that software and yes we do have a limit as to how
much mail you can send per hour. It is also possible to increase the
mailing quota limit. That policy
exists to ward off unsolicited bulk email. We can increase your quota up
to 500 messages
per hour. However, in order to do that we need to verify that every
single address that you have on file has opted-in for the subscription
twice. We need the time stamps, email addresses, and IPs of the
double-opted in confirmation. We will need to verify all of this
information in order to proceed. If you're unable to set this up then
you'll need to use our announcement list feature in order to send out
more mail.
If you aren't familiar with the Announcement list system that we have you
can check that out here:
http://tinyurl.com/4jou9c
The process of increasing your mail quota couldn't be started until after
you've become a customer with us. If you do need to send out more than
200 messages per hour then you'll need to request the mail increase.
Unfortunately, we can't really help with the installation. We have a
policy that we don't support third-party software. However, if you need
the assistance we will do our best to accommodate you. We don't install
the software for you but we can assist you with any questions and send
you guides and articles that we have or find on the Internet.
If you have any other questions, please let me know! Otherwise, I'd be
happy to get all of this started upon your reply! :D
Thanks,
Daniel G
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LMP worked fine when my new host transfered over the files and databases from my current site. I did not try a mass mailing yet. Concerned about the RAM usage on my new host, as I have never had to worry about it in the past with shared hosting. I will monitor it closely as the rest of my domains propagate. Paying $45 a month for VPS hosting with unlimited domains, 20gigs of disk space, 550gigs of bandwidth, and 320mb of RAM. Think RAM will be a problem and will be the deciding factor if I stay with this hosting. The $45 a month also includes Plesk control panel, which made the transfer of my other sites data much easier (even without having 'sudo' access because of Dean's absence (whatever 'sudo' means, not sure, but having that access would have made transfer easier and more efficient). I know I am headed to a dedicated server in the near future...so tired of restrictions. Think I can do a dedicated server with plenty of power with knownhost for about $110 a month. But that is down the road and after I evaluate the VPS hosting. Checked out dreamhost and was certainly turned off by the limit on emails. VPS hosting with them would remove that limitation (as it does with knownhost), but then again I will need to check my RAM usage when sending large email lists...it is always something! Good luck and keep me posted!
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I too have a site hosted with Dean and I too have NOT been able to get in touch with him for a long while now. I am trying to change to a new host for my site but I can not log in to my site's control panel.
Has anyone any idea about what happened to Dean or how to contact him?
He used to be so fast and good about replying to any trouble I had.
I just paid $20.00 to see if that would get him to respond but still no luck so far. :cry:
Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 10:53:13 -0500
Vendor Product ID : LM-update
Product Name : ListMailPRO - Update
Quantity : 1
Handling Fee : 0.00
Total : 20.00 ( USD )
There isn't a way to move a site without using the site's control panel is there?
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Long time user of listmail here... I have tried contacting Dean also, will let you know if I hear back from him of course I'm not holding my breath.
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Heard from Dean today (April 13, 2009) He wrote:
"I apologize for the delay. I have been away from email but still monitoring
system services...." And then went on to tell me he had fixed an issue I was having.
Of course this email comes after weeks of time spent moving all of my domains, files, folders, editing scripts, bugs, hours of support help, etc....and now he resurfaces. Boy I do not know what to do. To make things worse, I have sent an email back to him with a few questions and he has not responded for 2 days now.
I am having an issue with LMP when trying to load a txt file into my database. Keep getting "file cannot be found" message. Guessing this is an error due to my new host and some script adjustment, but Dean has not responded to my request for assistance....again.
Not sure if anyone else has made contact, but wanted to let you know that I did hear from him. Perhaps he contacted me because I was the only one who still has not canceled their subscription :)
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I thought that after I received an email from Dean, things would finally improve. Even after I moved a dozen or so sites (not an easy task), I still left one site with him and was hoping against hope things would change. Well, repeated attempts to contact him again AFTER he just sent me an email and stated ("any more questions or problems, let me know"), that was it. Sent 5 or 6 emails since that time and have received nothing. Yesterday, my one and only website left with Dean went down. I have now canceled my hosting with Dean and I am finished. I feel so bad about this because Dean has been incredible to me! The work he has done setting up my LMP and my website hosting was just phenomenal. It is so out of character for him to do business this way. Once I got the email I just assumed he was contacting everyone and it was back to business as usual. Sorry to see it is not.
I am fully moved over to knownhost and I FULLY recommend them to anyone considering new hosting. I have there VPS hosting package, VS2, which provides me with unlimited domains, 384mb of RAM, 20 gigs of Disk space, and 400 gigs of bandwidth.
Their support team is 24 / 7 and just fantastic. I have sent several tasks at them and they have finished within minutes. They are great! I only have one problem and it is not their fault. It included getting 'sudo' access to my old server to fix a problem. With Dean lost and confused, I am unable to give them that access to correct one of the problems. Not a big problem, so life does go on. I am paying $40 a month and have a nice, new up-to-date Plesk control panel included. Yes, it is certainly more money than I was paying with Dean, but I think my headaches are over and that is well worth the extra $300 to $400 a year I will be paying with Knownhost! Good luck to everyone. Hope your transition is / was as smooth as mine. Hope you will all share your migration stories for other users who are considering the move or perhaps are still in the trial period with their new host.
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Susan,
> 10%. Most of that is Comcast and sbcglobal.
How are you calculating your bounce rate?
Jangeli:
Sounds great, it looks like knownhost is good, I'll consider them... I'm working now at moving my entire lists over to GetResponse and Aweber, I figure one of those two will do everything I want.
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Hi Everyone,
Well, I know I said this before:
> I'm working now at moving my entire lists over to GetResponse and Aweber
But, I'm still not able to find a better solution than LMP (List Mail Pro). I love it too much and have been using it for years. It does everything I want, and, even faster/better than Aweber and GetResponse!
I can tell you what I found (after purchasing full accounts at Aweber/Getresponse).
---------------------------
1.) Aweber relies on Ajax and is too slow sometimes when updating pages (LMP is fast).
2.) To send to ALL of my members I have to 'Include' all of my lists (in LMP I just setup a User Selection for everyone and send away.
3.) GetResponse will not let me send a subscription by Email from inside of a program to my own lists - it checks the IP address and denies them every time. (With LMP I just put an include in my programs and instantly add someone to my list anytime).
There's one slight complaint I have with LMP, it doesn't send emails by 'time of day', in other words if someone signs up for a list at 2:15pm today, they will not always get their followups at the same time (Aweber does this, not sure about GetResponse). Instead with LMP they get their signups whenever I have DailyMail scheduled. It's not a big problem, I just wish I could be more detailed with the scheduling...
As you can see, I still love LMP, you can see from my posts (over 500) that I've been using it a long time, and solved quite a few problems with it, many of these things cannot even be done with Aweber/Getresponse.
Just to let everyone know, since I've found this program so useful, I'm now offering Custom Installations - to a dedicated server (I have one that I will recommend).
Contact me at my website for further info:
http://www.bgswebdesign.com
I hope everyone does get their LMP problems solved, but since Dean has been away from these boards for months now, I thought I would do my part to help out....
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(I'm using my client's account to post since I couldn't create my own.)
If anyone here needs help fixing their LMP installation or migrating to another solution, I'm available. I can also fix bugs in LMP if needed (found a couple in my client's version).
Contact me at mah@everybody.org
- Mark A. Hershberger
http://hexmode.com/
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Hi Everyone,
Yes, I've been using LMP for over 5 years, look at the number of 'posts' under my name on the left - contact me with any help/assistance you need with LMP.
I currently run a list of over 50,000 using LMP. :)
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Hi Everyone,
Yes, I've been using LMP for over 5 years, look at the number of 'posts' under my name on the left - contact me with any help/assistance you need with LMP. I currently run a list of over 50,000 using LMP. :)
Thanks for the offer.
I didn't realize there was a thread happening here so if anyone wants to pop over to http://listmailpro.com/forum/index.php?topic=2432.0 and then back to this one to continue on with it it would make sense for future users because the software is still available on the market. The above is an update as of today July 27, 2009 on LMP events around here.
For now I'll use the 2nd last version of the software. It does the job. Obviously this support issue has been going on a while. I wasn't aware of it. So many posts here for such a long period of time I can only come to a few assumptions:
- Dean has given it up without notice.
- He has been seriously injured or god forbid is dead and no one else knows how to get into these systems to let us know.
- I know a year ago he required full-time financial input from us (collectively to keep it going. It didn't happen. So maybe he's working full time somewhere and this is what it is. The end of LMP upgrading and support.)
- I don't know if anyone had the problems I had with the last version out as stated in the above thread but the previous version seemed to work fine.
- Third party services like GetResponse and Aweber (nothing personal to any and all of you using them) I stopped using when I came across LMP only because I wanted to ensure that there were no other copies of my list except with me and my hosting company.
I'm going to keep this thread on notify and if anyone comes across a package as good as or better than LMP please let me know (maybe someone already has and posted here? I haven't had time to go through this whole thread. Let me know though if someone has.)
If you even need help in the writing industry hit my help desk http://www.fwointl.com/contact/ttx.cgi with an email - Subject: ListMailPro User.
Anyway I guess that's about it.
Best of luck to you all.
Take care,
Rowdy Rhodes
Site Director
Freelance Writing Organization - Int'l.
http://www.fwointl.com/
LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/rowdyrhodes
- Creators of the Instant Writing Resources Tool Bar
http://www.fwointl.com/instant_writing_resources_tb.html
Use the tool bar files as a giveaway/incentive on your site.
- Est. 1999. 12,800+ members to date
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- #1 Writing Resource Site - The Writer
Publishers of:
Inkwell Newswatch (IN) -- Writer's Ezine
http://www.fwointl.com/in.html and
Writers Site News! Weekly Emailed Newsletter
[Archives at http://www.fwointl.com/wordpress/?page_id=166]
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Hi Rowdy,
> I'm going to keep this thread on notify and if anyone comes across a
> package as good as or better than LMP please let me know (maybe
> someone already has and posted here? I haven't had time to go through > this whole thread. Let me know though if someone has.)
There are 2 models here, and there are a few points to think about.
------------------------------------------------------------------
#1.) There is no such thing as free support - every type of support has a cost, the fact that Dean provided it for so many years shows you what happens - as a programmer and developer for over 20 years I have the experience and the education to make that statement.
After reading your other post, I'm sorry to hear that your paid support payments are not accepted, that is really bizarre, and I don't understand that at all - I've even asked Dean to consider selling LMP to someone that can care for it, but even those replies go unanswered - I have no way of knowing how to contact Dean at all - so don't ask! It's really weird what is going on and I don't understand why Dean would do this - well ,at least we have the older LMP versions that still do the job - that's important - so now it's time to look elsewhere for support, read below and you will know why...
When you ask for free support, you get a model like this where the software dies in the end, or people end up providing support on their own. You have to choose what you think is better, with the LMP model, you purchase software, and find your own support, and have your solution. With the Aweber/Getresponse model you pay a premium for the service and the support is provided.
#2.) I've tried almost every other mailing list software on the market, PhpList is about the closest you will come to LMP, but it still lacks some features, there are others, and yes I've probably tried them, I would guess I've tried 10-15 different mailing list software programs over the last 5 years.
There is no easy comparison, Aweber/Getresponse have both raised rates to make their services expensive for many list holders. The best option is a white label version of Aweber, such as XMailPro, or ProSender.
I've outlined all of this on my blog, you can read the article at:
http://www.profit-internet.com/comparing-autoresonders-getresponse-raises-prices.html
So, you have my opinion. What I feel is that many people up here are looking for free support, and it's not going to happen. As a developer I'm speaking the truth. You don't dedicate your life to software development and not realize what is going on. I've had numerous people ask questions and pick my brain for support and answers, but I can't do that for free.
Knowledge comes at a price, you don't go down to the local garage and ask them to fix your car for free - it's a similar model, think about it, programmers are experienced, trained and they deserve to be paid what they are worth - so, you either pay someone for support at this point, or use one of the white label services I mentioned... either of these 2 solutions will get you where you want to be.
Good luck!
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Hi Brett,
There is no such thing as free support
Other than the little stuff that comes along with software developing I've never asked for free support. Dean offered it because when I first hooked up with him his client base was small and the software needed a pile of work to bring it up to snuff.
every type of support has a cost, the fact that Dean provided it for so many years shows you what happens - as a programmer and developer for over 20 years I have the experience and the education to make that statement.
I agree, and as someone who has 30 years, is 50, had three separate self-employed careers; software developer, venture capitalist and now freelance writing you've hit the nail on the head.
After reading your other post, I'm sorry to hear that your paid support payments are not accepted,
That's not quite what I said. What I said was that paid tech support is taking orders. They are not being fulfilled. 2Checkout.com does followup on these types of transactions and when I told them what was going on, well after waiting a week I cancelled the order. Today 2Checkout reimbursed my PayPal account what was paid into Dean's account.
I have no way of knowing how to contact Dean at all - so don't ask!
I didn't, I do, and his personal email address is accepting mail but he is not responding except with a lag time of about 3 weeks. His last email to me was that he was still alive lol because I sent him three emails and the third asked if he was dead. {smile}
It's really weird what is going on and I don't understand why Dean would do this
If I had to guess his business model, if he even had one, wasn't built to handle the success he achieved in the number of LMP users. Since the price was low in the beginning it didn't generate enough money for him to be able to make a living and support the software. He did try though. I gave him a number of suggestions which he took seriously and implemented (e.g. LMP would not be able to perform demographical user selection without my input), but by then it was too late (I'm guessing because I don't know his finances). He put into place an affiliate program, he added paid tech support and most everyone balked, he removed himself from these forums to everyone's amazement. It's not all that weird. He was LMP user rich but cash and time poor.
at least we have the older LMP versions that still do the job - that's important - so now it's time to look elsewhere for support
Exactly and all I need to do is restore the last edition of the software and go back to my own business. As far as I can tell Dean has abandoned this one. Not nice. It can trap newbies who think this is a live site. It's not. So to anyone out there reading this thread: buyer beware (nothing personally Dean if you're reading this, but without developer response and no tech support, paid or otherwise, the best thing you could do is stop selling the software and turn off all levels of order taking.)
When you ask for free support, you get a model like this where the software dies in the end, or people end up providing support on their own. You have to choose what you think is better, with the LMP model, you purchase software, and find your own support, and have your solution. With the Aweber/Getresponse model you pay a premium for the service and the support is provided.
Aweber/GetResponse may work for you it doesn't for me. There's a difference in approach between us. I don't want to be dependent upon a 3rd party. I want to purchase the software (like LMP), run it and only have to rely on my server and the developer.
Unfortunately in this case the developer failed me. It's happened before, it'll happen again. Personally if Dean is not going to keep this going then I know someone who can build a system to do the exact same thing, he's established, has great php based products already on the market and has his own core mailing system built. What he doesn't have is the GUI, which you and I both know is the least of a developer's worries. I'll be sending him an email with this thread in it and asking him if he'd like to JV. I finance the gig and he builds the software. We split the profits. Assuming he's interested. He probably has other development plans right now.
PhpList is about the closest you will come to LMP, but it still lacks some features, there are others, and yes I've probably tried them, I would guess I've tried 10-15 different mailing list software programs over the last 5 years.
Yeah I have phpList here as well. Two problems I find are 1. It's open source (easy to hack and/or add crap to it) and 2. The support supplied by tincan would be of secondary nature since their mandate is "Tincan builds and maintains websites that enhance our clients' profile, income and online presence." These guys are not software developers. Better to find a package like LMP. It'll be out there. I research for a living (part of being a freelance writer) I'll see what, if anything, I can track down and keep you all informed. If you hear nothing, then I've found nothing - yet. At the same time I'll have my colleague take a look at the above JV concept. For every door that closes another opens.
There is no easy comparison, Aweber/Getresponse have both raised rates to make their services expensive for many list holders. The best option is a white label version of Aweber, such as XMailPro, or ProSender. I've outlined all of this on my blog, you can read the article at: http://www.profit-internet.com/comparing-autoresonders-getresponse-raises-prices.html
Informative article but as I mention above it's not what I'm looking for. I appreciate you providing possible alternatives though. Unfortunately you don't know anything about our business so there was no way for you to know that it doesn't apply to us, but for anyone reading this I'd suggest you read Brett's article. You might find your answers there because we're sure getting nowhere here.
So, you have my opinion.
Thanks. You have mine. Maybe between us we have given a few options and information to anyone who comes across this.
What I feel is that many people up here are looking for free support, and it's not going to happen. As a developer I'm speaking the truth. You don't dedicate your life to software development and not realize what is going on. I've had numerous people ask questions and pick my brain for support and answers, but I can't do that for free.
Well, sometimes it does and it works. It depends on your planning. This place needs to do a leap but financially it sounds like it may be too late. Unfortunately, for some unknown, unexplained reason, that leap is not happening and Dean is abandoning not only his LMP users but also his hosted users.
I can't imagine the level of frustration those people have gone through. My heart goes out to them. Moving web sites is not easy. Restoring software, while risky, I'd rather do the later. For those of you looking for an excellent, however expensive hosting company you can contact me at http://www.fwointl.com/contact/ttx.cgi subject LMP User and I'll hook you up with the guys I've been using all my sites for over the past 10 years.
Knowledge comes at a price, you don't go down to the local garage and ask them to fix your car for free - it's a similar model, think about it, programmers are experienced, trained and they deserve to be paid what they are worth - so, you either pay someone for support at this point, or use one of the white label services I mentioned... either of these 2 solutions will get you where you want to be.
You're sounding like a pitchman Brett lol "Pay Dean damnit!"
Well. That's not the solution. I paid, got nothing. The people who were hosting sites with him, they paid, got nothing, someone else I read here purchased support, got nothing. So what we have here is just one more unexplained Internet blip.
Personally playing Sherlock Holmes and trying to figure out what Dean is up to doesn't interest me. I needed tech support for a product I paid for and I paid for the support. I received nothing more than a refund. That tells me that this business is either already dead or Dean has gone on one very, very long and extended vacation. I hope he sends me a postcard. {smile} Maybe he generated a mint of cash and retired? {smile}
Either way, I do agree with you that it's time to move on and find other solutions. In the meantime, use the old, stay still until you're sure you've found what you need and then migrate. It's all that can be done unless Dean suddenly re-appears. That though would be highly doubtful and his level of credibility would be shot to hell. I like Dean, but this is after all a business that he appears to have abandoned, leaving many people in a lurch.
Good luck!
Best to you and yours.
Rowdy Rhodes
Site Director
Freelance Writing Organization - Int'l.
http://www.fwointl.com/
LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/rowdyrhodes
- Creators of the Instant Writing Resources Tool Bar
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Use the tool bar files as a giveaway/incentive on your site.
- Est. 1999. 12,800+ members to date
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- #1 Writing Resource Site - The Writer
Publishers of:
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Writers Site News! Weekly Emailed Newsletter
[Archives at http://www.fwointl.com/wordpress/?page_id=166]
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Hey Rowdy,
Great post, you've missed some of my points:
1.) I don't agree that Aweber/Getresponse is the best choice, it's a backup. In other words I run my LMP, and I double those subscribers over to XmailPro, that way when I have my own Mail Server problems it's not such a big deal, I'm not out of business and I can continue on, sort of.... I'm finding the click rate, and conversion rate from XMailPro to not even come close to what I can do with LMP - so watch for a followup to my article on my blog. http://www.profit-internet.com (http://www.profit-internet.com)
2.) Pay for support refers to me, or someone else up here that's interested in doing it, and not Dean. As a programmer, and with over 5 years running LMP I can help others who need it, but I'll need to be paid. I get people asking for this, that and the other, but by the time I respond (sometimes within 1 or 2 hours), they have hacked some solution together by themselves and on they go.... that's my point, they won't drop a dime to have someone fix the problem, so I'm just a sounding board, that's my point. I'm thinking, maybe I shouldn't even reply to the emails, just ask for $20 PayPal payment, and then I'll answer the questions....
I do agree, it's not totally odd, and you're right, if Dean doesn't want to support LMP, he should just dump it, and let someone else take over.
I'm curious about the developer you know of Rowdy, can you PM me with that information, or is he willing to sell, but, if it's not tested and he's not into GUI, I doubt I would be interested.... one thing that's nice about LMP, the nice clean interface, and it works, one thing I can't stand about Aweber and GetRsponse, the interface is so big and bloated, you can't get to anything simple, like SEND A MAIL! Yes, it is that bad... so, I have to say, I enjoy the LMP interface, and what I can see is just adding on more features myself to LMP, that would probably be the better solution, at least it will work the way I need it to work.
Well, I think that answers everything, hang in there, maybe next week, or month, or year LMP and the website will be gone! Kind of weird though, if you're making money at something, you don't just let it lay there, my guess is Dean is losing his ass, not making money at LMP. That's the part I find difficult to deal with, as many up here have made suggestions to him about monetizing LMP... I really doubt that he listened only to your opinions Rowdy, in fact ,he probably listened to several of us and took something from each, but if that makes you feel good - good for you...
I hope it all works out in the end... I'll still be posting my thoughts, findings and comments on my blog. I'm finding now that LMP is invaluable as a marketing tool, it's easier to work with, it works, and best of all, the click rate and conversion rates I get from LMP blow away anything I can get from XMailPro, GetResponse or anything else.[/url][/code]
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1.) I don't agree that Aweber/Getresponse is the best choice, it's a backup. In other words I run my LMP, and I double those subscribers over to XmailPro, that way when I have my own Mail Server problems it's not such a big deal, I'm not out of business and I can continue on, sort of.... I'm finding the click rate, and conversion rate from XMailPro to not even come close to what I can do with LMP - so watch for a followup to my article on my blog. http://www.profit-internet.com (http://www.profit-internet.com)
Ah. Understand. I'm just using my downtime waiting for the restore today to develop a couple of other items on the agenda. You know the old saying "A finished web site is a dead web site." There's always something on the plate.
2.) Pay for support refers to me, or someone else up here that's interested in doing it, and not Dean. As a programmer, and with over 5 years running LMP I can help others who need it, but I'll need to be paid. I get people asking for this, that and the other, but by the time I respond (sometimes within 1 or 2 hours), they have hacked some solution together by themselves and on they go.... that's my point, they won't drop a dime to have someone fix the problem, so I'm just a sounding board, that's my point. I'm thinking, maybe I shouldn't even reply to the emails, just ask for $20 PayPal payment, and then I'll answer the questions....
You want to support the software. Got it. {smile} Wish you luck. Without the developer odds are the sales will slowly dwindle to zero. You might make a few bucks in the short run, but even myself as an affiliate of LMP will be dropping the product. I won't put my reputation on the line when the guy who built the software has disappeared. If you want to hitch your wagon to that, well, that's your business decision.
I'm curious about the developer you know of Rowdy, can you PM me with that information
Nope.
Or is he willing to sell, but, if it's not tested and he's not into GUI, I doubt I would be interested.
He sells other products now. Been in business for years. Many of his product have mailing capability built into them. Just not as sophisticated as LMP. To build an equivalent would take time and money and that's what I intend to approach him about as a joint venture. I'll wait a bit. Pretty busy with my own stuff right now and so is he, but we can start talking and if Dean comes back we can ease off. Can't hurt to approach him though. I've known him and done business with him for years.
I enjoy the LMP interface, and what I can see is just adding on more features myself to LMP, that would probably be the better solution, at least it will work the way I need it to work.
You'd need either permission from Dean to sell it though or build add-in modules of your own that integrate otherwise you can't take Dean's software add stuff to it and call it your own. And it makes no business sense to do it for Dean if he's not around. So if you were going to add some bells and whistles they would have to be add-ins or just for your own use.
Well, I think that answers everything, hang in there, maybe next week, or month, or year LMP and the website will be gone!
Yup, but it's not the first time I've seen it happen.
Kind of weird though, if you're making money at something, you don't just let it lay there, my guess is Dean is losing his ass, not making money at LMP.
Well it is weird since he stopped taking orders and abandoned his hosting users. We'll probably never find out.
That's the part I find difficult to deal with, as many up here have made suggestions to him about monetizing LMP... I really doubt that he listened only to your opinions Rowdy, in fact ,he probably listened to several of us and took something from each, but if that makes you feel good - good for you...
Didn't mean it that way. Meant that the one area of the software he and I worked on was the selection area. He didn't have a clue as to how list management worked in the non-cyber world. The selection section of LMP, if I recall correctly, he rebuilt a number of times because he kept missing the point of what was needed to make a very effective package target in on both geographic and demographic information. I know there were a lot of people making a lot of suggestions about various aspects of the software. I was here. If you were one of them and that makes you feel better about yourself, cool. Dean was far from alone or using just one person when it came to suggestions on improving the software.
I hope it all works out in the end... I'll still be posting my thoughts, findings and comments on my blog. I'm finding now that LMP is invaluable as a marketing tool, it's easier to work with, it works, and best of all, the click rate and conversion rates I get from LMP blow away anything I can get from XMailPro, GetResponse or anything else.
It always works out. Patience and perserverence are the key. Maybe Dean's even detached himself completely so he can come back with a LMP version that'll take down both types of delivery services. Who knows? Only time will tell.
Well, this will be my last post here. It was nice chatting with you. I've got too much on my plate to bat back and forth LMP and the future of list mailing software. I'll come back if I find something comparable or better or if my friend and I decide to joint venture a package together and we're looking for testers.
Best of luck Brett.
Take care,
Rowdy Rhodes
Site Director
Freelance Writing Organization - Int'l.
http://www.fwointl.com/
LinkedIn http://www.linkedin.com/in/rowdyrhodes
- Creators of the Instant Writing Resources Tool Bar
http://www.fwointl.com/instant_writing_resources_tb.html
Use the tool bar files as a giveaway/incentive on your site.
- Est. 1999. 12,800+ members to date
- A Writer's Digest Top 101 Site
- #1 Writing Resource Site - The Writer
Publishers of:
Inkwell Newswatch (IN) -- Writer's Ezine
http://www.fwointl.com/in.html and
Writers Site News! Weekly Emailed Newsletter
[Archives at http://www.fwointl.com/wordpress/?page_id=166]